Jorginho is.... (well now was) a Blue

[Argo]

4 hours ago, mwblue10 said:

Assisted Tammy’s third goal yesterday right?   Can’t believe nobody’s talking about that .

Shows for me just how subjective assists are unless you do them at a ridiculous rate like KDB or Cesc. Jorginho's through ball to Mount when he hit the side netting would have been more worthy of the term assist then his actual one which was basically all Tammy's work. Another example would be Mount in a game for Derby last season at Millwall not technically getting an assist because he dummied it into David Nugent's path without touching it but in the context of the passage of play it was his assist.

The assist stat is one for fantasy football really, you can play the best through ball in football history yet you're still relying on the striker doing his job for it to go down on record while equally you can chalk up an assist for playing a one yard pass before someone smashes it in from the half way line or does a solo run.

Edited September 15, 2019 by Argo

[mwblue10]

1 hour ago, Argo said:

Shows for me just how subjective assists are unless you do them at a ridiculous rate like KDB or Cesc. Jorginho's through ball to Mount when he hit the side netting would have been more worthy of the term assist then his actual one which was basically all Tammy's work. Another example would be Mount in a game for Derby last season at Millwall not technically getting an assist because he dummied it into David Nugent's path without touching it but in the context of the passage of play it was his assist.

The assist stat is one for fantasy football really, you can play the best through ball in football history yet you're still relying on the striker doing his job for it to go down on record while equally you can chalk up an assist for playing a one yard pass before someone smashes it in from the half way line or does a solo run.

I completely agree.

However, the fact remains that plenty of posters on this forum and many of the fan base in general, have complained about Jorginho’s lack of assists.  Now, when he finally gets one, mums the word.

[Argo]

39 minutes ago, mwblue10 said:

I completely agree.

However, the fact remains that plenty of posters on this forum and many of the fan base in general, have complained about Jorginho’s lack of assists.  Now, when he finally gets one, mums the word.

I certainly haven't been. Jorginho's role especially when playing a 3 man midfield isn't to create or score it's to keep things ticking over in the middle and in general he's done fine. The control in the middle of the park was one of our strengths last season and i honestly found the campaign against him from the media and pundits truly truly bizarre, it's one thing fans and punters getting their knickers in a twist over a DLP not racking up assist after assist but the sheer amount of "experts" paid to offer us quality insight to the game peddling those very same notions was unbelievable. 

Any working class industry if you apply for a position and you have such poor knowledge of the field you're looking for employment in you won't even get past the application stage however with football punditry it seems to be the opposite, the more clueless you get the more appealing you are to TV company's.

Edited September 15, 2019 by Argo

[dkw]

8 hours ago, Argo said:

I certainly haven't been. Jorginho's role especially when playing a 3 man midfield isn't to create or score it's to keep things ticking over in the middle and in general he's done fine. The control in the middle of the park was one of our strengths last season and i honestly found the campaign against him from the media and pundits truly truly bizarre, it's one thing fans and punters getting their knickers in a twist over a DLP not racking up assist after assist but the sheer amount of "experts" paid to offer us quality insight to the game peddling those very same notions was unbelievable. 

Any working class industry if you apply for a position and you have such poor knowledge of the field you're looking for employment in you won't even get past the application stage however with football punditry it seems to be the opposite, the more clueless you get the more appealing you are to TV company's.

Fully agree, it was so bizarre (And still is) that people constantly whine about his lack of assists as though thats the only reason a midfielder has for being on the pitch. He has a specific job to do and does it well, I bet  his team mates absolutely love that he is always available for a pass to take pressure of them for example. Its always amusing when fans and pundits see things in black and white nowadays, there`s no allowance for nuance, Someone is either the bestest ever or utter garbage.

[Guest Sindre]

Actually think he's been better this season then most of last. A lot to like about his attitude, hard worker and tries to be a leader and take responsebility on the pitch which is good as well.

[Brutos]

Rio started it and everyone ran with it, what annoyed me most was Chelsea fans going with it also that really annoyed me. I could see he was hurt by the boos and the fans behaviour towards him was just embarrassing. I have never booed a Chelsea player and never will unless he disrespected the club then maybe.

[Argo]

6 hours ago, Brutos said:

Rio started it and everyone ran with it, what annoyed me most was Chelsea fans going with it also that really annoyed me.

Didn't Rio say it after the Arsenal game? As much as he didn't help it started long before that, the first time I had to set the record straight to someone about him was as early as the West Ham away game! 

[GhostOfDembaBa]

It's not about lack of assists or goals with him. It was that he just wasn't doing enough offensively or defensively. 

Keep things ticking over and be available for the pass... Not exactly asking a great deal. Sure, it was meant to be a key part of Sarri's system but when that system isnt really delivering the goods, of course Jorginho will get stick especially when he's missing on the cover and the team is suffering record breaking heavy defeats to teams like Bournemouth.

He was caught out a couple of times in high profile games as well which didn't help his cause.

He looks better this season but he was poor the last imo and the criticism from pundits and fans alike was well justified.

[Argo]

40 minutes ago, GhostOfDembaBa said:

It's not about lack of assists or goals with him. It was that he just wasn't doing enough offensively or defensively. 

Keep things ticking over and be available for the pass... Not exactly asking a great deal. Sure, it was meant to be a key part of Sarri's system but when that system isnt really delivering the goods, of course Jorginho will get stick especially when he's missing on the cover and the team is suffering record breaking heavy defeats to teams like Bournemouth.

He was caught out a couple of times in high profile games as well which didn't help his cause.

He looks better this season but he was poor the last imo and the criticism from pundits and fans alike was well justified.

If they think he's not doing the job he's meant to be doing well enough then fair enough, I would disagree for the most part but at least their questioning him legitimately which I have no issues with. However a lot of people jumped on the "no assists" and "taking Kante out of his best position" bandwagon which at that point quite frankly it gets to amaetur hour.

[Slojo]

Jorginho's passing was actually really sloppy in the first 30 minutes of the game, really sloppy by his standards but after that his passing was crisp. I think his passing has been really good this season so far, I don't know why he keeps getting compared to Cesc, Cesc never had the defensive reliabilities that Jorginho has or played as deep. 

I think he's the best passer in the team easily. 

[Nevamind]

1 hour ago, Slojo said:

Jorginho's passing was actually really sloppy in the first 30 minutes of the game, really sloppy by his standards but after that his passing was crisp. I think his passing has been really good this season so far, I don't know why he keeps getting compared to Cesc, Cesc never had the defensive reliabilities that Jorginho has or played as deep. 

I think he's the best passer in the team easily. 

He played in a two with Matic. He for sure had defensive duties. 

[Slojo]

3 minutes ago, Nevamind said:

He played in a two with Matic. He for sure had defensive duties. 

Matic during his first 3 years was an absolute machine and covered the ground, Fabregas had far more freedom. 

Eventually we started to get exposed with Fabregas in the pivot because he wasn't covering the ground he was supposed to, that all started in the Spurs 5-3 game at home when we were like 4-0 down in the first half or something. Jorginho has far more defensive responsibilities than Fabregas ever has, he plays a lot deeper. 

[evissy]

Jorginho has taken of the squad and midfield as you would expect. He is a leader-type and he likes the control. People who say he is Sarri's boy can shut up for good (don't really know if here is even one).

[PloKoon13]

Should absolutely not be playing in a midfield two with Kovacic. A very telling sign of our current lack of options in the middle. 

[Brutos]

He probably won more tackles and made more interceptions than anyone else in our team last night

[I Am Gay 4 Diegod]

Can we just admit after that Liverpool game Jorginho is absolutely class now? The amount of amazing passes over the top, keeping possession, tackles tracking back everything he was innhendersons face non stop to the point Henderson backed down and he’s usually a little gobsh*te Jorginho is an absolute beast, proper player has evolved his game his long passing was special, easily 10-15 passes over the top like fabregas, non stop dog fighting and doing the dirt work, unbelievably good player, I cringe when I see people say they can’t see what he brings you may aswell write I know nothing about football apart from how to be a casual and an armchair fan.

[Guest Sindre]

Offensively he's very good but he makes mistake defensively. What is he doing opening up all that space for Fabinho to run into for their first goal? Lampard needs to have a look at that and fix it.
Because sometimes he gets too eager in his pressing which leaves too much space behind him which is exactly what cost us today.

[abramovich]

53 minutes ago, I Am Gay 4 Diegod said:

Can we just admit after that Liverpool game Jorginho is absolutely class now? The amount of amazing passes over the top, keeping possession, tackles tracking back everything he was innhendersons face non stop to the point Henderson backed down and he’s usually a little gobsh*te Jorginho is an absolute beast, proper player has evolved his game his long passing was special, easily 10-15 passes over the top like fabregas, non stop dog fighting and doing the dirt work, unbelievably good player, I cringe when I see people say they can’t see what he brings you may aswell write I know nothing about football apart from how to be a casual and an armchair fan.

Jorginho does attempt a lot of Fabregas-like over the top passes but, unlike Cesc, he fails to connect on far too many of those for my liking. I like his confidence and workrate and he does certain things well, but I still have a feeling he needs to play in a certain system in order to be truly effective. 

[goose]

Sorry but still not a fan. Please don’t anyone compare his passing ability to Fab. Many of his over the top balls lack imagination and quality and are like something seen in Sunday league and easily swept up by quality defenders.

Now he does do some things well like recirculate the ball and often is available to help others out and this can be important.

He probably also has other off and on field  leadership qualities that I’m not aware off.

[Brutos]

The media really did a job on some fans when it comes to Jorginho they really have he is easily one of the best players week in and week out when it comes to passing tackling recover interceptions....he constantly dictating play urging players to push up and press and people still going on about assist, he can't actually get assist if the striker attacking players aren't putting is chances created away...can't expect him to be doing it all by himself pass then chase down his won past to score.

[Gol15]

Yea he's not Fabregas. Feel sorry for anyone that thought he was. That said, I think he can pass those long balls better. 

[GhostOfDembaBa]

He's playing with a lot more authority and is actually adding to the team, not so much of a liability but his forward passing just not up to the level atm.

He's showing a kind of spirit and fight that I like though. Was better than Kovacic for sure today. Kovacic just looks a passenger in the team too often. 

[opinionsarelike]

One of the reasons why we dominated Liverpool to the extent we did late in the game is because of Jorginho. His ability to hit passes early, as well as his range of passing, is what makes Liverpool have to move their entire team from side to side.

Fabregas was a much better passer in a vacuum, but he could never control games from the mid circle like Jorginho could. They are two different players, and comparing them directly helps no one.

[Davey Baby]

3 hours ago, I Am Gay 4 Diegod said:

easily 10-15 passes over the top like fabregas

 

Possibly the most inaccurate thing anyone's ever said on this forum.

[I Am Gay 4 Diegod]

10 hours ago, Davey Baby said:

 

Possibly the most inaccurate thing anyone's ever said on this forum.

Alright none was as spectacular as that ball fabregas could play once or twice a game but there was plenty of long, forward, “ over the top” balls that was accurate.  He absolutely is a better player though, he is tenacious jwins so many tackles. Fabregas was totally not press resistant I remember him getting raped in that pivot when things went wrong, Jorginho is unbelievably good, he dominated Liverpool in that second half and about the last 15 mins of the first it was him playing balls to alonso and mount that caused them to sh*t themselves and stop breaking on us so easily.

Kante is my fave player but goal aside Jorginho easily had a better game and you see the comments of how Kante is a miracle and then start to see how vastly underrated jorgi is, it’s a shame he doesn’t get better support because I think if there’s one player out there that not only gives his 100% but makes sure the whole team is it’s jorginho and he should be made captain. Him or rudiger anyway.

Edited September 23, 2019 by I Am Gay 4 Diegod