Official Thomas Tuchel *Now Sacked*

[RMH]

Have to admit that the first ten minutes or so we looked lively and we were quick to recover and pass the ball, but the only danger came from CHO’s crosses. The team then reverted to Sarriball. Not complaining about Tuchel as he has had no time with the squad, but had he watched a few videos of our games he would not have dropped Mount tonight “for the experience”. Also, seeing Alonso back in the team sheet was strange. The formation also baffled me a bit as I thought that a 343 would be more suited to counterattacking proposal a la Conte, and I thought it rather precautious against wolves at home and really needing the three points. We’ll never know if with Frank we would have won this, but we came from a victory over a championship team where we played quite well, IMO, so was expecting to see some build up on that. Let’s hope that Tuchel sees the gems of the academy and keeps developing them, otherwise it’s going to be less exciting to watch our team for me. Today, when I saw the formation and the midfield, it was a meh...

[Imran_CFC]

I was a little disappointed he didn't change the formation and replace one of the CB's and also disappointed he didn't make the subs sooner. 

Still too soon to judge him and hopefully he makes a few changes for the betterment of the team after getting to know the squad better. 

[strider6004]

Says he is used to making 5 subs so was careful making just 3.

After listening to him speak picked up a few things:

• Excellent English
• Big on maintaining positive outlook which reminds me of Klopp
• Intensity and energy seem big concepts for him. 
• Says he expects todays levels of intensity to continue.
• Asked the squad about what to watch our from Wolves, so they worked on preventing counter-attacks.

 

 

 

[coco]

I think he's a good talker, i like listening to him, got a lot to say and crams loads in to the interview. I like the positive vibe and eagerness to get on with it. I hope he will learn quickly about the players, we can't afford to stall for too long. I don't want to hear him using the word 'experienced' again, that's ok for the first game, but now judge players on the pitch not their length of playing time.

[haviet1]

I really don't understand some of you on here already judging the guy after his first game, second day in the country, and perhaps 2 hours training with the team?

At least give the guy until game #2 or #3, see what kind of changes and adjustments he make before you even attempt to assess him.

His roster and starting 11 elections today makes complete sense. A guy that's new to the league and the team during mid season, he took the diplomatic approach in not trying to rattle or upset some veterans and experienced players. That's why you see Giroud, Rudiger, Jorgie, Azpi, etc. starting today; with Alonso back on the bench. After today's games, I see many of these guys spending lots of time on the bench in the near future, if not this Sunday.

Give the guy a chance, he's not here to f**** Chelsea; he's hear to "win titles". 

[axman2526]

3 hours ago, haviet1 said:

I really don't understand some of you on here already judging the guy after his first game, second day in the country, and perhaps 2 hours training with the team?

At least give the guy until game #2 or #3, see what kind of changes and adjustments he make before you even attempt to assess him.

His roster and starting 11 elections today makes complete sense. A guy that's new to the league and the team during mid season, he took the diplomatic approach in not trying to rattle or upset some veterans and experienced players. That's why you see Giroud, Rudiger, Jorgie, Azpi, etc. starting today; with Alonso back on the bench. After today's games, I see many of these guys spending lots of time on the bench in the near future, if not this Sunday.

Give the guy a chance, he's not here to f**** Chelsea; he's hear to "win titles". 

I dont hold it against him what happened to Frank, however I expect better than what we saw from the likes of Chilwell, Ziyech, Havertz and Giroud today. A lot better.

[evissy]

One thing that popped from his comments was the 16 recoveries he mentioned 3 times in the post game presser. That to me tells he is coaching through numbers. Now someone might be put off by it but I personally like the idea of using the data available to you.

Tuchel seems to be much more like Pep than Klopp in terms of football he likes. I hope he realizes even Pep have ditched the possession based football and tweaked it towards to a more direct style. He could already see a quality side like Wolves can easily hold on to clean sheet by sitting deep. There are 15 quality sides in the Prem that can do that. 

He should watch some of the matches we played under Sarri. You need to be more dynamic and let opponent to your half to have a chance to open defences. Neto finishes that one chance they had and it is welcome to Prem moment for him. Nuno was pretty pleased the way they played. 

 

[abramovich]

The man had one training session with the team. One.

If you lot demanded more time and patience for Frank after season and a half, surely Tuchel deserves more than a day to be properly judged.

[Spiller86]

9 minutes ago, abramovich said:

The man had one training session with the team. One.

If you lot demanded more time and patience for Frank after season and a half, surely Tuchel deserves more than a day to be properly judged.

I think a lot of us are just blowing off steam, at the idea he was appointed so rapidly after a club legends unceremonious departure. I wouldn't read too much into it.

I'm sure we'll all get behind him once he works out not to play Jorginho and to stop the billion passes for no shots Sarriball approach. 

[Bob stark]

1 hour ago, evissy said:

One thing that popped from his comments was the 16 recoveries he mentioned 3 times in the post game presser. That to me tells he is coaching through numbers. Now someone might be put off by it but I personally like the idea of using the data available to you.

Tuchel seems to be much more like Pep than Klopp in terms of football he likes. I hope he realizes even Pep have ditched the possession based football and tweaked it towards to a more direct style. He could already see a quality side like Wolves can easily hold on to clean sheet by sitting deep. There are 15 quality sides in the Prem that can do that. 

He should watch some of the matches we played under Sarri. You need to be more dynamic and let opponent to your half to have a chance to open defences. Neto finishes that one chance they had and it is welcome to Prem moment for him. Nuno was pretty pleased the way they played. 

 

Nah, pep doesn't ditch his style. His team will always try to dominate possession. How they attack and the speed come down the player that he has. It is that simple. 

 

[Coxy15]

Tuchel clearly deserves to be given until the end of the season before firm judgements are made. I think his team selection yesterday was awful, and hopefully he will learn that quickly too. I understand his concept of selecting experience but it doesnt pay off when your best players are the young ones like Mount and Tammy who is fresh off a hattrick. Play form players, not older players and you might get a better result.

 

I think dropping Mount felt like a statement about a change in regime, purely because Mount trumps havertz for experience AND form, so why not start him?

[Gol15]

2 hours ago, evissy said:

One thing that popped from his comments was the 16 recoveries he mentioned 3 times in the post game presser. That to me tells he is coaching through numbers. Now someone might be put off by it but I personally like the idea of using the data available to you.

Tuchel seems to be much more like Pep than Klopp in terms of football he likes. I hope he realizes even Pep have ditched the possession based football and tweaked it towards to a more direct style. He could already see a quality side like Wolves can easily hold on to clean sheet by sitting deep. There are 15 quality sides in the Prem that can do that. 

He should watch some of the matches we played under Sarri. You need to be more dynamic and let opponent to your half to have a chance to open defences. Neto finishes that one chance they had and it is welcome to Prem moment for him. Nuno was pretty pleased the way they played. 

 

He's a good coach, from his perspective he bossed the opposition in his first game already, Wolves had 0 shots on target by the end of the game so for just having 1 training session the day before this is laughable.

Pep didn't ditch possession based football, no big team would want to do that anyway, Pep said after the game against us that his team simply can't play up and down, they must find their rhythm and pass pass pass till they break us down.

Sarri finished top 3 with his tactics, let's not forget that. 

[evissy]

1 minute ago, Gol15 said:

He's a good coach, from his perspective he bossed the opposition in his first game already, Wolves had 0 shots on target by the end of the game so for just having 1 training session the day before this is laughable.

Pep didn't ditch possession based football, no big team would want to do that anyway, Pep said after the game against us that his team simply can't play up and down, they must find their rhythm and pass pass pass till they break us down.

Sarri finished top 3 with his tactics, let's not forget that. 

He did well in the first game absolutely. Wolves had one massive opportunity to win it also.

Pep pretty much have transformed his style towards a type that fits his players and the prem. It is not the same he started with City some years ago. "Ditched" is a strong word I give you that.

Sarri did great so I want him to watch how Sarri fared with possession-based football. All the good and all the bad.

All in all I want Tuchel to do well and after 1 training session he did well and he did what he thinks is right. He was very open on the choices and his ideas. I liked everything he said.

[Slojo]

11 hours ago, Gol15 said:

Say what you want about Jorginho but he brings stability to this squad, we conceded 8 goals only and had 6 clean sheets with him in the starting lineup this season in the league.

The only game that we lost when he started the game was at the start of the season against Liverpool after Christensen got a red card.

Tuchel played the duo from last season that made us a top 4 team and suddenly Kovacic had a good game after not playing well at all for quite some time.

I don't think I want to see Kante-Kovacic again, that is the most horrible thing that has happen to us this season, probably contributed a whole lot to Lampard losing his job as well...

Wait so you rate Kovacic now? I can't tell which personality mode you're in. 

Jorginho hasn't played well for quite some time, and I'm actually quite disappointed in his lack of risk taking. At the start of last season under Frank, Jorginho was constantly floating balls over and trying killer passes, now he's gone back to sideways mode, same with Kovacic. But Kovacic does get forward more and has better retention, so I would prefer to have him in the starting lineup over Jorginho right now. 

 

[dansubrosa]

1 hour ago, abramovich said:

The man had one training session with the team. One.

If you lot demanded more time and patience for Frank after season and a half, surely Tuchel deserves more than a day to be properly judged.

Nobody is calling for him to be sacked. I’m still pissed off about the sacking and wanted to take out my frustration on the team selection. Dropping Mount, only one academy player in the starting line up and then we had to watch dross.

I’ll be fully behind Tuchel when I’ve moved on from Frank and he also starts backing the academy players. James and Mount are too good to rot on the bench. I feel the same about Gilmour and I’m unsure what Tuchel thinks of him.

We’ll know more after a few more games.

[dkw]

Just now, dansubrosa said:

Nobody is calling for him to be sacked. I’m still pissed off about the sacking and wanted to take out my frustration on the team selection. Dropping Mount, only one academy player in the starting line up and then we had to watch dross.

I’ll be fully behind Tuchel when I’ve moved on from Frank and he also starts backing the academy players. James and Mount are too good to rot on the bench. I feel the same about Gilmour and I’m unsure what Tuchel thinks of him.

We’ll know more after a few more games.

Well put, this is exactly how I feel. I have absolutely nothing against Tuchel, hes a manager been given a job and I hope he does well. My biggest problem is with the hiring of Frank Lampard and the academy lads coming through I felt a connection to the club again after several of losing interest as we slogged from one new shiny manager to the next, new shiny overpaid mercenary player to the next with no plan and no real affinity with the fanbase. This coupled with the way football is now going, diving, VAR, corruption, disparity in financial clout between the big clubs and the rest etc and I just was losing interest in the game, and Chelsea. Then along came a legend as manager, who was bringing our exciting young players not only onto the bench but front and centre in the team, they were given responsibility and were running with it. It was fantastic, I felt a connection again, a reason to watch the matches that didnt entirely hinge on the result. I could see where we were heading, a club built around the fabled academy with a manager who got the club  (and I hate using this f**king term as its so scouse) and hopefully had the long term backing that enabled us to build progressively without fear of being booted out after 5 or 6 bad results......oh how naive I was. Now hes gone, the new manager dropped the young players for the experienced plodding sh*te we have had to put up with and we end up with a match of such unimaginable dross. I would understand had he dropped the young players because they were out of form and struggling, but he dropped a striker that had just got a hat trick, a midfielder who has easily been our best and most progressive one and a right wing back for a left winger. So forgive me if I wasnt celebrating the next new shiny manager like some are.

[Gol15]

8 minutes ago, Slojo said:

Wait so you rate Kovacic now? I can't tell which personality mode you're in. 

Jorginho hasn't played well for quite some time, and I'm actually quite disappointed in his lack of risk taking. At the start of last season under Frank, Jorginho was constantly floating balls over and trying killer passes, now he's gone back to sideways mode, same with Kovacic. But Kovacic does get forward more and has better retention, so I would prefer to have him in the starting lineup over Jorginho right now. 

 

Kovacic played like sh*t this season, this was his best game so far.

With Jorginho we don't lose the game by half time. Without him Kovacic played poorly most of the time this season.

Tuchel isn't stupid for relying on Jorginho and he had both him and Kovacic as the two number 6 players, Lampard did the same thing last season and it worked. You saying that Tuchel should automatically stop playing Jorginho makes no sense when you see how things have looked this season.

So many people cried how we needed Kante to "protect the backline", that was the real sideways mode and how did that work in comparison to just having progressive passes and stability?

Tuchel won't play like this every game that much I can try to predict but he knew that he can rely on a system-based player to at least not lose the game, he's now the 3rd coach we have that automatically saw the value of having a player like Jorginho.

[evissy]

8 minutes ago, Slojo said:

Wait so you rate Kovacic now? I can't tell which personality mode you're in. 

Jorginho hasn't played well for quite some time, and I'm actually quite disappointed in his lack of risk taking. At the start of last season under Frank, Jorginho was constantly floating balls over and trying killer passes, now he's gone back to sideways mode, same with Kovacic. But Kovacic does get forward more and has better retention, so I would prefer to have him in the starting lineup over Jorginho right now. 

 

For me it was weird Chilwell nor anyone else didn't look for Havertz runs. The one pass he received ended up with a chance where Chilwell shot well over the bar from a great position. Giroud is very slow to and easy to be picked up by defenders. He was available to run behind lines all the game, no one looked at him. Other players probably don't trust him yet which is natural after seeing some of his performances. The other time he was end of a ball was the last kick of the game where he was denied a goal. That header was going in. 

Anyway I agree on the sideways passing. Although that is a type of defending in Tuchel's books. In 0-0 and tight games especially.

[big blue]

I really dont think people need to be worried about 'sarriball 2.0" if you one of those that were offended by it. 

Tuchel sets up differently depending on opposition, some games we will set up to counter, like we saw him do in the champions league final. He will use long balls into the channels, he wil play a variety of formations, and he will rotare alot aswell.

Last night was a combination of wolves sitting very deep, and showing no real intent to push forward and press high, and the fact we had Kovacic ad Jorginho controlling things in midfield who play very safe passes. Another factor that contributed to the amount of possession, was actually how well we counter pressed, and won the ball back very quickly. 

It was not a particularly entertaining game by any standard, but we still got in behind enough times to have created big chances to score, it was just the choice of pass and movement in the middle was not cohesive, which has been an issue all season. Hopefully Tuchel will be able to improve this, because his Dortmund side were excellent in this regard, and when they got behind the defence, it usually ended with a god chance. 

Early days but promising signs.

[RMH]

3 hours ago, evissy said:

One thing that popped from his comments was the 16 recoveries he mentioned 3 times in the post game presser. That to me tells he is coaching through numbers. Now someone might be put off by it but I personally like the idea of using the data available to you.

Tuchel seems to be much more like Pep than Klopp in terms of football he likes. I hope he realizes even Pep have ditched the possession based football and tweaked it towards to a more direct style. He could already see a quality side like Wolves can easily hold on to clean sheet by sitting deep. There are 15 quality sides in the Prem that can do that. 

He should watch some of the matches we played under Sarri. You need to be more dynamic and let opponent to your half to have a chance to open defences. Neto finishes that one chance they had and it is welcome to Prem moment for him. Nuno was pretty pleased the way they played. 

 

Apparently he's brought with him a data analyst, so there you have the answer to your first paragraph.

[Slojo]

3 minutes ago, dkw said:

Well put, this is exactly how I feel. I have absolutely nothing against Tuchel, hes a manager been given a job and I hope he does well. My biggest problem is with the hiring of Frank Lampard and the academy lads coming through I felt a connection to the club again after several of losing interest as we slogged from one new shiny manager to the next, new shiny overpaid mercenary player to the next with no plan and no real affinity with the fanbase. This coupled with the way football is now going, diving, VAR, corruption, disparity in financial clout between the big clubs and the rest etc and I just was losing interest in the game, and Chelsea. Then along came a legend as manager, who was bringing our exciting young players not only onto the bench but front and centre in the team, they were given responsibility and were running with it. It was fantastic, I felt a connection again, a reason to watch the matches that didnt entirely hinge on the result. I could see where we were heading, a club built around the fabled academy with a manager who got the club  (and I hate using this f**king term as its so scouse) and hopefully had the long term backing that enabled us to build progressively without fear of being booted out after 5 or 6 bad results......oh how naive I was. Now hes gone, the new manager dropped the young players for the experienced plodding sh*te we have had to put up with and we end up with a match of such unimaginable dross. I would understand had he dropped the young players because they were out of form and struggling, but he dropped a striker that had just got a hat trick, a midfielder who has easily been our best and most progressive one and a right wing back for a left winger. So forgive me if I wasnt celebrating the next new shiny manager like some are.

Context is important though. 

It's not like we haven't been piss poor for weeks now, don't get me wrong that match was f**king awful to watch but come on, we've been absolutely w**k since the Leeds game. All our football has been just like that, lots of possession and about 3 shots towards goal. 

And realistically, James has got an injury, Azpi has been playing for a while now. Abraham has been rotating a lot this season, it was only Mount who got dropped, CHO started and played the full 90. Under Lampard that was very rare. 

I think people are really missing a lot of context. Talk about mercenaries, Lampard, Drogba, Cole, Cech, where they all Chelsea youth? Yet they're still Chelsea legends aren't they. Players will come and go, we'll get new legends in the future, and they can be from France, Brazil, Ghana, wherever, it doesn't matter. I loved the whole Youth process but let’s be honest, it was a pipe dream, the last thing I wanted to be is like Arsenal, look how that project went under Wenger once the invincibles went and he started this new Youth project. 13 years and 3 F.A. Cups, that's it. Compare that to what we won during that period and if you would prefer to have Wenger I would want you institutionalised. 

[Slojo]

5 minutes ago, evissy said:

For me it was weird Chilwell nor anyone else didn't look for Havertz runs. The one pass he received ended up with a chance where Chilwell shot well over the bar from a great position. Giroud is very slow to and easy to be picked up by defenders. He was available to run behind lines all the game, no one looked at him. Other players probably don't trust him yet which is natural after seeing some of his performances. The other time he was end of a ball was the last kick of the game where he was denied a goal. That header was going in. 

Anyway I agree on the sideways passing. Although that is a type of defending in Tuchel's books. In 0-0 and tight games especially.

I mentioned this about 3/4 times in the Match thread, Chilwell seriously needs dropping and reassessing. 

He doesn't link up well with his winger, but he kept flat out ignoring Havertz when he had acres of space to run into. This is the Chilwell Leicester fans were warning us about, the one who drifts with the ball into the centre and completely ignores his winger. 

[dkw]

Right, I`ll spell this out for you. This is nothing to do with how you or anyone else feels, this is how I felt and why I was pissed of with the whole thing. There is no context, its my feelings on it. None of the stuff you say matters to me.

[RMH]

2 hours ago, abramovich said:

The man had one training session with the team. One.

If you lot demanded more time and patience for Frank after season and a half, surely Tuchel deserves more than a day to be properly judged.

Well, we've learnt our lesson that in today's football is all about the here and now, and the results and the silverware that "we fans are entitled to" from the get go. So let us, at least until our wounds are healed, be a bit sarcastic and sour.

[Slojo]

1 minute ago, dkw said:

None of the stuff you say matters to me.

Stab me in the heart why don't you?