He cost 30 million because hair like that doesn't come cheap

13 minutes ago, PloKoon13 said:

This is quite possibly the most pointless debate in the history of the forum. It's the Euthyphro dilemma all over again - is Luiz a starter because he cost £30m or did he cost £30m because he's a starter?

 

(I am aware that's not the nature of the argument but I can't think of anything funnier right now)

That's why I am out, it's pointless and going round in circles. It must also be boring for everyone else to put up with it.

14 hours ago, Ernie_blue said:

1. So a club signs a 30m defender to sit on the bench? Don't ever see that much in football.

 

  

3 minutes ago, ForeverCarefree said:

  

Otamendi - 48 appearances last season, 7 this year. Not really a sub.

Mangala - never signed to be a sub it's just he is no good. Some players are not cut out for the Premiership and he is one.

4 hours ago, Ernie_blue said:

If people can't see when you sign a defender for 30m it's to play football and not to improve the squad then you know very little about football. Signing Williams is to improve the squad, spending 30m is for a first team player.

Using Michy isnt a great example. His young and one for the future. He probably expected less game time. Luiz would never of signed expecting to be on the bench.

Its like saying Utd signed Bailly, Arsenal signed Mustafi, City signed Stones. They were all signed to play.

LOL, you can surely see the two are not mutally exclusive? I just don't belive his price tag means Conte has no choice but to start him... if that means I know "very little about football" then so be it!

I am sure Luiz had confidence in the fact that his ability would be earn him a starting place, but I am sure he wasn't guaranteed one and his price tag is irrelevent. 

Michy was one example, you could aslo use Pedro, same price and similar age to Luiz. Point remains trasnfer fee will never ensure a starting place in Managers starting 11. 

wonder if he will play central tonight now that JT is playing?

Edited October 26, 20169 yr by DonAntonio

I think its evident that Luiz at the heart of a back 3 is by far our best option.

Call me crazy, but in my opinion, Van Dijk and David Luiz are the best CB's in the league at the moment. Our defence is looking so strong, Luiz is the key. Stands tough in the central of the defense. Gets first to the ball and always asks for the ball to move the ball faster.

2 minutes ago, IliyaKrostin said:

Call me crazy, but in my opinion, Van Dijk and David Luiz are the best CB's in the league at the moment. Our defence is looking so strong, Luiz is the key. Stands tough in the central of the defense. Gets first to the ball and always asks for the ball to move the ball faster.

You're not crazy, David Luiz has been great since he returned and Van Dijk has been rock solid for Southampton for over a year now. Southampton fans love that he is flying under the radar, they don't want to lose him.

11 minutes ago, IliyaKrostin said:

Call me crazy, but in my opinion, Van Dijk and David Luiz are the best CB's in the league at the moment. Our defence is looking so strong, Luiz is the key. Stands tough in the central of the defense. Gets first to the ball and always asks for the ball to move the ball faster.

No you, are not crazy. I agree. The media and pundits will wait for him to make one mistake and slander him for it. However when he is great like he has been for a while now, he will not get the credit he deserves. He reads the game, gets stuck in, wins aerial duels and is fantastic for our play from building at the back. Maybe people need to look at why we have kept 4 clean sheets in a row. The whole team have helped but I feel in that 3 man defence, he is the driving force becaise he takes control and that gives signs of leadership.

Not a Conte type player, they said.

Can't defend, they said.

Liability, they said.

 

4 clean sheets in 4 games, oh.

 

 

so far so good since the switch to a back 3. his weaknesses are masked and his strengths are well utilised. 

still think you could make a case for any of the back 3 (or 5 including the wingbacks) being short term solutions in their positions, mind.

but it does show that good coaching (or the right kind of coach) can squeeze more out of a player even in their late twenties than one might think. in a flat back 4 he was exactly as expected IMO, but this is already the best run of performances he's had in a blue shirt. I said before that he's had a lot of great defensive minds work with him so I doubted that conte would be the one to suddenly get a tune out of him but it appears that needs reconsidering. I'm unsure what is being done differently because I don't think it can be just the shape, there is a hitherto unseen conservatism in his game at the moment. perhaps it is because conte is talking the players through the game as it happens?

being ultra critical there are still mistakes in his game, and they remain evident even in this run just like there still are in cahill's. but I don't expect them to be cannavaro or nesta. 

I'm pleased with how he's playing for the most part and I have to say he is adding value to the team at the moment which I severely doubted he could.

Call me crazy, but in my opinion, Van Dijk and David Luiz are the best CB's in the league at the moment. Our defence is looking so strong, Luiz is the key. Stands tough in the central of the defense. Gets first to the ball and always asks for the ball to move the ball faster.

Far from crazy he has been one of the best defenders

It really doesn't feel like he even left.

He's done a terrific job so far, but he is just part of a block of five central players that make it very hard for the opponents to break through.

4 hours ago, g3.7 said:

so far so good since the switch to a back 3. his weaknesses are masked and his strengths are well utilised. 

still think you could make a case for any of the back 3 (or 5 including the wingbacks) being short term solutions in their positions, mind.

but it does show that good coaching (or the right kind of coach) can squeeze more out of a player even in their late twenties than one might think. in a flat back 4 he was exactly as expected IMO, but this is already the best run of performances he's had in a blue shirt. I said before that he's had a lot of great defensive minds work with him so I doubted that conte would be the one to suddenly get a tune out of him but it appears that needs reconsidering. I'm unsure what is being done differently because I don't think it can be just the shape, there is a hitherto unseen conservatism in his game at the moment. perhaps it is because conte is talking the players through the game as it happens?

being ultra critical there are still mistakes in his game, and they remain evident even in this run just like there still are in cahill's. but I don't expect them to be cannavaro or nesta. 

I'm pleased with how he's playing for the most part and I have to say he is adding value to the team at the moment which I severely doubted he could.

As usual spot on. There are still obvious weaknesses which he will never lose, such as holding a marking position. He still often gives in to his natural tendency and is dragged towards the ball rather than stopping where he is and marking his player. But overall he looks transformed from the error strewn disaster he was in his previous spell and, in a back three, that can only be down to the coaching.

There was one occasion in the second half today where we were under pressure down our left flank, Alonso had been drawn inside, Cahill covered over and closed the byline off, the ball moved central, Cahill and Alonso swapped positions as the ball came back to the left. There was no hesitation, no looking at each other. That rotational positioning has been coached IMO and it is great to see. Likewise as you rightly point out, a conservatism, exampled by his no nonsense clearances today, is starting to appear in Luiz's play that was never there before and I can only reason that that too is also down to the coaching he is getting.

It is no secret that I am not Luiz's greatest fan but, like the rest of our back line, he is currently doing a good job in a new system which they are still learning. All credit to him, Conte and our defensive coaches and long may it continue.

12 hours ago, g3.7 said:

so far so good since the switch to a back 3. his weaknesses are masked and his strengths are well utilised. 

still think you could make a case for any of the back 3 (or 5 including the wingbacks) being short term solutions in their positions, mind.

but it does show that good coaching (or the right kind of coach) can squeeze more out of a player even in their late twenties than one might think. in a flat back 4 he was exactly as expected IMO, but this is already the best run of performances he's had in a blue shirt. I said before that he's had a lot of great defensive minds work with him so I doubted that conte would be the one to suddenly get a tune out of him but it appears that needs reconsidering. I'm unsure what is being done differently because I don't think it can be just the shape, there is a hitherto unseen conservatism in his game at the moment. perhaps it is because conte is talking the players through the game as it happens?

being ultra critical there are still mistakes in his game, and they remain evident even in this run just like there still are in cahill's. but I don't expect them to be cannavaro or nesta. 

I'm pleased with how he's playing for the most part and I have to say he is adding value to the team at the moment which I severely doubted he could.

Cant argue with any of that, great to see him playing so well in a 3 which obviously suits him down to the ground allowing him freedom to bring the ball out and start our attacks, and he is definitely much better positionally. 

Luiz is a top class defender who gets scapegoat because of who he is when other top defenders make just as much mistakes they are get ignored

I love his passing ability most of all, those long range balls on the deck or in the air set up seriously dangerous attacks and switch us from a defensive position to an attacking one in a heartbeat.

 

 

I was a huge proponent when we signed him I was sure he matured watching him at PSG and that a manager like conte would get the best out of him, the fact is he is a terrific footballer bags of talent, big, strong, athletic and if he makes the right decisions he can be a terrific defender, I think we are seeing his maturity and decision making and he can now be called a defender without hesitation, no question. 

At the moment he is proving all the doubters wrong. He's been excellent. 

Been phenomenal the last five games.

Graham Sourness is currently choking on a massive slice of humble pie. 

Keep it up Geezer.

He's proven a lot of people wrong since he came back, here's hoping he keeps his concentration

Best CB in the league on current form. Being an absolute beast.

1 hour ago, Sindre said:

Best CB in the league on current form. Being an absolute beast.

second best to this specimen

 

 

sorry i can't help it im such a fanboy

Edited November 5, 20169 yr by havelschayes