4 hours ago, Bob stark said:

This thread is a bit bizzare. It is like Ziyech was awful since the beginning. 

Ziyech was fantastic for us early in the season. He was easily one of our best performer playing as rw drifting inside. The problem right now what Tuchel want.  If he want to get the best out of werner then probably no spot for Ziyech 

Well, Chelsea isn’t a club ran by football people, so being awful from the beginning isn’t that far away from reality. Lit up a farmers league in his ‘late’ twenties, no other clubs in Europe wanted him, giant ego, bad attitude, lazy, skinny little twig legs and no physicality, can’t shoot but every so often can lazy around and pick out a genius ball time to time.

2 minutes ago, turnyitb said:

I agree he looked good first few games and i was an admirer of him at Ajax but he looks like a confidence player and not one who takes it to well when the chips are down. 

I haven't written him off btw, he's had no preseason, I think it's obvious he has quality. 

But f**k me, his attitude is not there, I've never seen a player look so miserable since Torres. I hope that's just how he usually looks and I'm looking into it. 

It's clear he's a luxury player, but luxury players are also useful. 

Just now, Term_X said:

Well, Chelsea isn’t a club ran by football people, so being awful from the beginning isn’t that far away from reality. Lit up a farmers league in his ‘late’ twenties, no other clubs in Europe wanted him, giant ego, bad attitude, lazy, skinny little twig legs and no physicality, can’t shoot but every so often can lazy around and pick out a genius ball time to time.

Not exactly true, he was also very good in Europe, he showed that against us twice for one. 

1 minute ago, Slojo said:

Not exactly true, he was also very good in Europe, he showed that against us twice for one. 

He was good but for our ‘supposed’ ambitions some pretty glaring weaknesses which other “properly run’ football clubs with football people making decisions wouldn’t touch with a barge pole. 

Don't think we're likely to see Ziyech at his best in a chaotic game like that. You can see what Tuchel intended with the Jorginho/Ziyech double sub - shame it failed miserably!

I think Ziyech will be at his most effective against teams who are parked in their own box, when he can launch balls at the back post for Giroud/Chilwell/Alonso to get on the end of. (Four assists so far - against Sheffield United, Burnley and Morecambe).

That said, it is a regrettably esoteric skillset. Maybe if he were very good at one other thing (say shots on goal from free kicks) it would be worth consistently starting him. At the moment he just seems to be the most luxury of luxury players. Him having what I like to call 'Anelka face' probably only exacerbates this impression.

 

Not written him off yet too early for a player his calibre. Form is temporarily class is permanent 

6 minutes ago, Brutos said:

Not written him off yet too early for a player his calibre. Form is temporarily class is permanent 

If Tuchel insist on this system the you can write him off 

His ‘actual’ standout season for Ajax was met by tumbleweed from Europes elite, as they picked up De Jong & De Ligt. What serious clubs sign luxury players nowadays?, there is a reason Arsenal had a ‘free run’ to sign Ozil and we had a ‘free run’ to sign Ziyech.

Would help if he actually tried. If anything it looks like he has to much confidence.

What shocks me most is that his corners are soooo like Williams’!! He hasn’t beaten the first man in any recently.

As I said previously, Ziyech seems to be the odd man out. He simply does not fit this team or the EPL very well.

When you give him plenty of time on the ball, he'll whip in those wonderful crosses....BUT,  EPL defenders don't give you that kind of time on the ball. When you take his crosses away, he simply has nothing else to offer.

He's a luxry player at best.

3 minutes ago, haviet1 said:

As I said previously, Ziyech seems to be the odd man out. He simply does not fit this team or the EPL very well.

When you give him plenty of time on the ball, he'll whip in those wonderful crosses....BUT,  EPL defenders don't give you that kind of time on the ball. When you take his crosses away, he simply has nothing else to offer.

He's a luxry player at best.

Except ours that is!

I believe Tuchel could easily sub Ziyech off and not CHO.

Didn't like the way he came in, he was uninterested, lack of energy, motivation. 

This is not the Ziyech we had in the beginning.

16 minutes ago, IliyaKrostin said:

I believe Tuchel could easily sub Ziyech off and not CHO.

Didn't like the way he came in, he was uninterested, lack of energy, motivation. 

This is not the Ziyech we had in the beginning.

Probably frustrated by the situation. Under performing, injury stunted season, new system, new country/team mates and new coach. If the fans were in the stadium I'd like to think he would show a bit more enthusiasm.

Edited February 20, 20215 yr by LongtimerLurker

He was like that when he first came into the team after the injury, then a string of games quickly changed our opinions of him. I don't see how Pullisic and Ziyech will get game times with the current setup, Tucel seems to favour 2 strikers, and Mount must play.

10 minutes ago, icecoolguy22 said:

He was like that when he first came into the team after the injury, then a string of games quickly changed our opinions of him. I don't see how Pullisic and Ziyech will get game times with the current setup, Tucel seems to favour 2 strikers, and Mount must play.

It is very simple stop insisting on playing two up top. 

He was a great player for Ajax and performed well in the CL. I thought it was a great signing by Lampard.

In order for our attack to finally work Tuchel must switch to a 4-2-3-1, this thing with the back 3 has given us results so far but it won't last.

CHO, Ziyech and Pulisic are all pure wingers after all.

54 minutes ago, Bob stark said:

It is very simple stop insisting on playing two up top. 

The way we’re going we’re going to end up playing 9 at the back and 1 up front...

19 hours ago, Brutos said:

Not written him off yet too early for a player his calibre. Form is temporarily class is permanent 

 "Form is temporary, class is permanent" . I like that Brutos. I'll have to try and use that in future.

If you believe the papers, he doesn't want to be here. If you look at him on the pitch, he looks like he doesn't want to be here.

I do wonder if he doesn't want to be here.

The guy has talent, and is a class player. 

but....

 

... I have zero confidence that he can be relied upon to fight, scrap and dig in for a result.

He appears to me to be a player who looks world class when others are playing well, but doesn't have the will, mindset, ability (any or all!) to take a game by the scruff of the next and change it.

He also has the look of someone who gives up easily, and gets effected by poor form/ results. In short - a lack of bouncebackability 😳

He's the cherry on top of the icing on top of the cake. Unfortunately we have a rancid cake and a thin layer of icing at the moment. Until we address the weakness in the spine of our team all these adornments we have bought recently will struggle.

15 hours ago, IliyaKrostin said:

I believe Tuchel could easily sub Ziyech off and not CHO.

Didn't like the way he came in, he was uninterested, lack of energy, motivation. 

This is not the Ziyech we had in the beginning.

Would be a worse outcome in terms of player confidence i think as Ziyech is established. 

If Tuchel could have subbed him off do you think he would have? 

29 minutes ago, ForeverCarefree said:

If Tuchel could have subbed him off do you think he would have? 

Has their ever been a sub-subbed-sub ?

3 minutes ago, coco said:

Has their ever been a sub-subbed-sub ?

Sort of thing Brian Clough might have done ... taken a player off and replaced him with no-one just to make a point LOL

Edited February 21, 20215 yr by Sexyfootball